Hello, To those who read this, this is my first post. I am feeling the need to vent my frustrations on you hippocrite walk-on-water; oh-so-better-than-YOU Christians who may be spying on this board. I am a twenty-something woman who is an Atheist due to a personal journey I decided to embark upon. My reasons for turning away from the church are my own, so I won't go into that. I am so sick and tired of sitting down to a meal in public restaurants with my partner (Husband) who is also an Atheist and overhearing so-called Christians trying to "Preach" the bible. Everytime I hear it; I CRINGE and say just loud enough for the religious zealot to hear as well "Honey, aren't you glad we're ATHEISTS?" to my husband. Freedom of speech is one thing, but forcing your ideas on another are CRAP. I grow weary of you zealots that think just becuase you have "His" Blessing, etc. that you are better than me. Newsflash: You're not. Personally, I like to SWIM in water; NOT WALK ON IT!!!!

Angela

Hi Angela, This is my first post on here also. Usually when responding to people i would like to ask questions, because it just simplifies and clarifies the point/s you and or i would like to make. It helps us understand our position and gives clarity to the elements of our understanding we believe in. My first question is why does it frustrate you? are you not able to ignore what they are saying? if not why not? What would you say to christians who were complaining abouth athiests and about all the stuff they are saying? whether in puplic or on the web(is there a difference) Does this occur a lot(you sitting down for a meal and hear christians talking about their faith)? I hope you dont mind answering my questions and entering into what i hope to be a good honest open clear and adult conversation.

Thanks, Murdoch

Murdoch said, "Usually when responding to people i would like to ask questions, because it just simplifies and clarifies the point/s you and or i would like to make. It helps us understand our position and gives clarity to the elements of our understanding we believe in."

Did you mean it helps us understand our positions? Angela made her position very clear. Do you understand that she doesn't have a "belief" that she needs to make everyone in a public place (who are not interested) understand? You seem to be the one that didn't make your position clear. But don't bother- I think I can figure it out.

Murdoch said, "My first question is why does it frustrate you? are you not able to ignore what they are saying? if not why not?

I think she made it clear that they were deliberately putting on a display that she could not avoid hearing, and she made it clear that it happens often. When non-believers pay to eat out in a (non-religious) public place they have the right to do that without harassment.

I don't know all that Angela has experienced, but I do know that stalking happens. Some of them make it their business to know who are not followers in their communities, and they make it their personal business to make trouble for them at every opportunity. Sometimes they go a lot further than just praying and preaching in restaurants and other public places.

Murdoch said, "What would you say to christians who were complaining abouth athiests and about all the stuff they are saying? whether in puplic or on the web(is there a difference) Does this occur a lot(you sitting down for a meal and hear christians talking about their faith)? I hope you dont mind answering my questions and entering into what i hope to be a good honest open clear and adult conversation."

Since she hasn't answered this I will. There is a big difference! You don't have to read an atheist web site unless you choose to do so. I have never experienced an atheist making a public display of non-belief. I have never had an atheist come to my door or fill up my mailbox with worthless prattle like the brainwashed xians are instructed to do. She made it very clear by saying "I am so sick and tired of sitting down to a meal in public restaurants with my partner (Husband) who is also an Atheist and overhearing so-called Christians trying to "Preach" the bible." I doubt that she would be sick and tired if it only happened a few times. I don't think that she could have made the situation any clearer. Maybe you just don't get it.

Forcing your ideas is beating someone or locking them up, threatening or any other similar thing, until that someone succumbs to your believes.

Repeating a lot of nonsensical crap over and over again is not forcing your ideas on someone.

I just think that it's completely OK for a preacher to speak his mind out in the public. Why not? But it should be just as normal for me to tell him to shut up because he is annoying, and I'd like some quiet, while eating. Or even better, if I'm not lazy, correct him in his ignorance.

That is freedom of speech...

If you ask for some kind of law which would prevent people from yelling out their religious (or any kind of) believes, be careful what you're asking for.

internet me said, "Repeating a lot of nonsensical crap over and over again is not forcing your ideas on someone."

Not if those people who are required to be in a public building are being forced to listen to someone repeating nonsensical crap over and over again. The workplace, schools, etc. That is against the law.

internet me said, "I just think that it's completely OK for a preacher to speak his mind out in the public. Why not? But it should be just as normal for me to tell him to shut up because he is annoying, and I'd like some quiet, while eating. Or even better, if I'm not lazy, correct him in his ignorance."

The original post never mentioned a preacher speaking his mind in a public restaurant. However, there are laws that protect people who are required to be in public buildings and institutions from being forced to listen to religious preaching.

As a matter of fact, in a public restaurant or place of business the owner should stop any public preaching that would disturb the peace of the other customers, and I'm sure the best way to handle it would be to report them to the management.

This year in a settlement with the NYCLU in New York City, Long Island and New York State government agencies have agreed to a settlement that will prevent religious proselytizing to the poor with tax dollars. This is a core element of the First Amendment. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" Thomas Jefferson in his 1802 historic letter to the Danbury Baptists quoted this and added "thus building a wall of separation between church and state". This country was meant to be a secular one, otherwise they will have to revise the history.

The Establishment Clause separates Church from State and courts have interpreted that to mean even the federal government cannot proselytize. That is why the National Day of Prayer is unconstitutional. Judge Barbara Crabb, who said the event violates the First Amendment's establishment clause banning the creation of a "law respecting an establishment of religion" in the Constitution.

internet me said, "That is freedom of speech..."

Proselytism is not protected in certain environments open to the public or owned privately for instance, government buildings, public education, the workplace and private properties. That is freedom from religion.

I'm sure everyone will listen when God appears and speaks for Himself. If god only speaks to them, then they should follow His example and do the same.